Episode 441: Unmasking ADHD & Autism: Leanne Maskell’s Journey to Empowerment
The journey to self-discovery is seldom straightforward, especially for individuals navigating the complex worlds of ADHD and autism.
In this episode, Adam Stott welcomes Leanne Maskell, a leading authority in ADHD and autism, to explore her transformative journey and insights into neurodivergence. Leanne shares her experiences from her early beginnings in modelling to recognising her ADHD and autism later in life.
This episode provides a comprehensive overview of how these diagnoses have influenced her decisions, both personally and professionally, whilst offering actionable insights for those facing similar challenges.
Show Highlights:
- Leanne Maskell’s journey of embracing ADHD and later autism diagnoses shows the importance of self-awareness and acceptance in personal growth and professional success.
- ADHD can influence career paths, pushing individuals towards entrepreneurship due to the need for novelty and flexible structures.
- Success with ADHD involves creating environments that cater to one’s specific needs and understanding weaknesses without judgment.
- Leanne stresses the importance of community support and personal exploration to overcome societal stigma surrounding neurodivergence.
- Leanne highlights the impact of ADHD coaching on her life, helping her harness her potential and channel her unique skills into a thriving career.
Links Mentioned:
Get your Business Growth Secrets SUCCESS PLANNER for FREE and profit like a pro: https://adamstottplanner.com/free-book47315172
Adam’s website: https://adamstott.com/?el=Pod
Watch the Episode on Adam’s YouTube Channel: https://www.youtube.com/adamstottcoach?el=Pod
Connect with Adam on Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/adamstottcoach/?el=Pod
Join Adam’s network on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/adam-stott-coach/?el=Pod
Coaches, consultants, and business owners – lower your marketing costs, increase ticket prices, and get more high-ticket clients: https://3daybrandbuilderworkshop.com/start-here?el=Pod
Transcript:
Please note this is a verbatim transcription from the original audio and therefore may include some minor grammatical errors.
Adam Stott: Hello everybody and welcome to today’s episode of Business Growth Secrets. I’m really, really excited, uh, from a, from a business and a personal level to be bringing on an amazing guest today, someone that you know has made a real impact in the world of A DHD autism. Has trained over 500 coaches, uh, somebody that has had an, an amazing career, written five books, been the author of five books, and they are really an expert in the space of A DHD and autism.
[00:00:36] And, and I know personally my little boy has got autism, but I know personally as well from I. Literally every single week. Having people in our conference rooms that talk about A DHD talk about autism, you know, they’re finding out later in life they’re going through these different things, how important it is to have this conversation.
[00:00:53] So I want to give a huge welcome to Five Times author, uh, autism, A DHD expert, Leanne Maskell. Welcome, Leanne. How are you? You good?
[00:01:02] Leanne Maskell: Hi, I’m very good. Thank you for having me.
[00:01:04] Adam Stott: Yeah. Brilliant. I’m, I’m super excited, as I said to, to really hear from you. You’ve got had, you know, what sounds like an amazing career and a very varied career.
[00:01:12] So we want to dive into that and, and sort of understand, you know, how you’ve got to where you are now. So, if you were sort to take us back to the beginning of your career, you know, I’m aware that perhaps you didn’t know about A DHD back when you started out. What, what was it like going on your professional career?
[00:01:29] Not really understanding, you know, some of the things that might have been holding you back and, and what was that like? Get, take us back to the beginning. Let’s jump in.
[00:01:36] Leanne Maskell: Well, my career actually started at the age of 13 because my mom signed me up to a modeling agency and I didn’t really want to do modeling, but then found myself in vogue for my first job.
[00:01:48] And there, it’s interesting because I actually learned how to mask really well, my symptoms, ’cause I hated modeling and I just wanted to go home and. I had a lot of situations that weren’t really right, like people getting me changed and being made to pose in ways that were really uncomfortable, et cetera.
[00:02:07] But. I learned to pick up the signs from people around me of like what they wanted me to do and how to get out of there as quickly as possible. And now I understand that particularly A DHD and particularly autism, because I didn’t know how to say no, I felt really uncomfortable. And ironically, I was also in Cyprus, so everyone spoke Greek, so it was literally like we were talking a different language.
[00:02:29] So that was quite difficult. And I came over to London for university at 18 and did law. But I had no idea like what I wanted to do at school. When I got all, A’s the teacher asked the whole class if I cheated. ’cause she was like, it’s not possible that Leanne has got all A’s. And I agreed with her, but I hadn’t cheated.
[00:02:48] I just didn’t listen at school. But I could teach myself all of the information. The month before exams. And then when I came over to London, I got scouted at Westfield to do modeling again, uh, and said they don’t really want to do it. They were like, please come and meet us anyway. So I went to meet them.
[00:03:06] They said, you have to lose, um, three inches of your hips and then we’ll take you. And I was like, what? You’ve asked me to come here and, uh. And I said no. And then they called me up and the woman that scouted me and said, I’m gonna get fired if you don’t do it, please, can you just try? So I tried. So I basically carried on modeling, which is a really difficult job to do, especially now looking back and knowing about the A DHD and autism, because it is like playing the lottery every day.
[00:03:34] You find out what you’re doing at six o’clock at night every single day. And if you want any time off, you have to ask permission and give no reason why. And I did some amazing jobs, like I worked for a source and urban outfit tourism, and went to the Maldives, and I was on the cover of magazines, but a lot of the time I was doing nothing and that was really, really difficult for me mentally.
[00:03:55] I would just obsess all day over what to do with my life. Really struggled to go to university and engage in it, but managed to graduate with a two, one. All of my friends were going on with their life and, uh, getting graduate schemes and I just had no idea what to do and was really, really overwhelmed.
[00:04:14] So I tried all different kinds of jobs when I graduated from fashion to marketing and restaurant pr, and then I would quit everything. Um, a few days in, I would basically ask anyone I knew for work experience and then kept quitting. I had the modeling still where I was. Getting paid quite well to do one day of work, but that doesn’t necessarily translate to the real world because
[00:04:39] Adam Stott: that might
[00:04:39] Leanne Maskell: be
[00:04:39] Adam Stott: your
[00:04:39] Leanne Maskell: only job.
[00:04:40] Adam Stott: What was it that put you in the place where you kept quitting? Do you feel what was happening there?
[00:04:44] Leanne Maskell: I think it was the sense that I had to pick one career and that was it for life, and then I would start to, I would see that mainly people were unhappy. And it was boring. And then I was like, Nope, can’t do it.
[00:04:58] And then I would get called up to do modeling and I’d be like, no, I’m not doing this. Nope, not this job. And then I would change career completely, or I would think that maybe people didn’t like me. Um, I had one job where it was marketing and the person that was working with told me to cold cool people, and she gave me a script.
[00:05:16] I just burst into tears and now looking back, I understand why, but I felt like the weakest, most stupid person ever. I was like, why can’t I just make a phone call? But now I understand a lot more about. Why that was and why I would go in and quit these jobs and I would also always go in and kind of give too much in the beginning and try to redesign the whole company.
[00:05:38] I would see all of the problems and the inefficiencies and be like, why don’t you do this? Why don’t we set this up? People don’t like that. And companies, they like the status quo. They do not want you coming in and trying to redesign it all. So that kind of led to me over time. I went to Australia and I became really, really suicidal and I.
[00:05:57] Really struggled because I just felt like I didn’t fit into the world. I felt like I was completely hopeless. Could kind of do modeling, but not really because every job you do is like the last job that you think you’re ever gonna get. You get paid three months after doing a job if that, and. In Australia, my mental health declined.
[00:06:16] I eventually went to a doctor. He told me that I was fine because I had a law degree. They said, you just need to pick one thing and stick to it. And I was like, I know. I know that I would if I could. And then eventually managed to go to a psychiatrist. I came back here and went to a psychiatrist after I went skydiving and burst into tears because the parachute opened.
[00:06:37] So I came back here, went to a psychiatrist. By that point, I’d researched what was happening to me and I was convinced. That I had like 15 different conditions and a DHD and autism were not included. And the psychiatrist said, no, no, you don’t have any of this. You’ve got a DHD. I was like, that is not a real thing.
[00:06:54] He was like, yes, it’s, and you’ve got it. And uh, I, it took me a year to go back and finish off that assessment, but when I did, I said, yes, I believe you. But even learning about. That he’d sparked something in my brain so that the next time I had this kind of meltdown, I was able to learn about it from things like podcasts, et cetera, because I’m not like a hyperactive little boy.
[00:07:16] Um, I have a law degree, so I accepted it and then my life completely changed. I went on medication, but that whole process was really stressful and really expensive, and I managed to get a job at the law society doing mental health and immigration legal policy. Which was maybe the happiest day of my life.
[00:07:37] I was like, and because I knew that about the A DHD, I was like, right, I’m not gonna quit this. And I know now someone has confirmed to me that I will quit jobs because of this. A DHD. So I moved over the road, I got a flat, an eight month contract, and they flat on Chancery lane that was over the road from the office, which I didn’t realize was weird until I had to tell someone where I lived.
[00:07:59] And then again, in that job I really saw the A DHD and autism. Funny
[00:08:02] Adam Stott: job. Don’t think that’s weird. I, nothing’s practical, right?
[00:08:09] Leanne Maskell: I knew that trains were a big issue for me, like commuting. So I was like, okay, we need to reduce all of the opportunities where I might quit. So if I went on a train and I. That would be an example of reason I’ve quit before.
[00:08:22] Adam Stott: Hey everyone, hope you’re enjoying the podcast. We’ve got a free training that I’m doing right now online from the comfort of your own home called Stand Out Brand. What this does is it shows business owners how to get noticed on social media, stand out. Get more leads and get more sales. So if you want to make more money in your business, head over to adam.com/sob.
[00:08:46] That’s adam.com/sob and join us on the free three day workshop. Standout brand, like you know, when you turn up to the tube, not interested in the quitting part. I mean, there’s a lot of things that I’m. Interested in, because I think it can really help a lot of people that listen to this podcast because you know, I know that there are a lot of people that experience the frustrations that you’re talking about, and then they do go into this blame mode and they’re like, why can’t I just, why can’t I just do what I know I need to do?
[00:09:17] Why can’t I just get this done? And obviously, you know, being an ex expert in it now, and obviously you haven’t experienced it, you kind of alluded to the fact that you had, you felt like you had a pressure. If I do this thing, it has to be forever. That has to be perfect. Is that, is that what it was? Is that what you would say was the issue?
[00:09:38] And then if it didn’t line up to your expectations, you just wanted to bolt out of the situation? Is that how you saw it?
[00:09:44] Leanne Maskell: Yeah, I think I felt like. It was a prison sentence, getting a job. It was like, if I get this job, then I have to commit to it and I have to build up experience. And I also felt when I was younger that, especially when I was finishing university, there were kind of two paths laid out.
[00:10:02] One, make money and do something that doesn’t help the world at all, but makes rich people more money and have no life or do something that helps people but make their money and. Struggled to survive. And that those two paths looked really depressing to me. And I wanted to do something good that would help people and creative and not just go to an office every day.
[00:10:28] And again, I didn’t really realize at the time, even how much being in an office affected me like the lighting and the people around you. And I think for me, that was. Where I was like, it’s all or nothing, black or white. Either I am a restaurant PR expert or I’m not, and then we have to quit and we have to go onto the next thing.
[00:10:46] Which in retrospect really helped because you know, now I coach a lot of people that are stuck in jobs where it’s really, really hard to quit. That’s the hardest thing for them, especially when they actually get to the kind of a hundred K salary point. It’s really tough for them to leave and do something that they want to do.
[00:11:03] So I do feel quite lucky about that, but I also think it’s really important to share because. People would look at me now, like you said, you know when, whenever I hear that kind of bio, I just, I’m like, really? I sound quite successful. But in reality, like I, you know, I’m still that 21-year-old that was like, what on earth and I meant to do with my life.
[00:11:22] Like everyone else has got it figured out and they’ve read the manual to life and I seem to fail at everything. And it does feel like being out of control of your own brain. Like you’re living in a TV show where things are happening, but you don’t know how to control it. Hmm.
[00:11:37] Adam Stott: It’s interesting. What, what’s also interesting is the law degree, obviously it requires a lot of discipline, a lot of commitment to go and do that.
[00:11:44] How do you have like both those things going on at the same time? So you go and get that law degree. Did you, you, did you have to knuckle down for that? Did you, what was your, what was the process of that for you? I
[00:11:55] Leanne Maskell: picked law because I didn’t know what else to do. My friend went to like university, and then when I went into lectures I was like.
[00:12:02] I literally, it feels like they’re talking Chinese and I don’t speak Chinese. Mm-hmm. And so I didn’t go to lectures and I didn’t do the reading because it was really boring. And instead I had modeling anyway where I was being told I had to go and do various jobs. And I. I just managed to teach myself all of it at the end of the year.
[00:12:24] And again, kind of like that. What
[00:12:26] Adam Stott: was your, do you like have hyper focus, for example? Is that, is that what happened? Yeah.
[00:12:31] Leanne Maskell: So now I can look back and understand how, so A DHD is connected with this interest based nervous system. Which is if there is adrenaline or novelty or interest, we can hyperfocus amazingly.
[00:12:44] So for me, getting to one month before the exam, knowing that I had not been to any lectures, meant that I could just knuckle down and only do studying every single day and learn everything. And a friend gave me some of the notes, which I memorized. And also I understand with the autism, something called hypoxia, which is advanced reading and writing skills, kind of the opposite.
[00:13:05] Of dyslexia, but I could, I can read and write a huge amount of information, and what I would do is understand what the exam was marked on, like the structure, and then I would just learn the necessary information to pass that structure. And I found out that they don’t take marks from you for. What you write, um, only if you don’t write something, so they wouldn’t take marks off.
[00:13:28] So in the exams, I would just write as much as I possibly could, and I knew how to pass exams, but that’s not really that helpful when you graduate into the real world. And also when you can’t remember any of that information.
[00:13:40] Adam Stott: Oh, very interesting. So as, as you move past that, and, and the reason I’m so interested is, is like I said, so I meet people, we’re training, um, entrepreneurs, business owners all the time, is very much, um, these, some of these traits that you’ve been discussing, you know, very evident in, in different business owners, entrepreneurs, all the time that you see, you know, which is mentioned.
[00:14:00] Certainly the hyper focus. I think that’s something that I, myself, uh, uh, certainly do as well, right? So I can get very interested in one thing and, uh, and as I’m interested in it. I, I want to consume and learn every single part of it. And, uh, I can do it very quickly actually, which is, uh, interesting. Uh, but then if I’m not interested in something, it, it just can’t hold your attention.
[00:14:19] Right? So it’s, uh, a very usual type of thing. So as you, as you go on this, uh, this journey, you come out of law, you’ve had the modeling, which is, I suppose, was it because it was so far, you can go in for a day. And then you come out and then you go back in for a day. So it became easy to pick it up and it, it sort of fits that model of quitting.
[00:14:37] ’cause you do it and you’re done and then you do it and you’re done type thing. And you, you go on that journey. So what, what happens next after you’ve got the law degree? How do we then, you said you, you went to a psychotherapist mm-hmm. And you got this. This diagnosis and now you, now, you know. So what changes for you now you have the awareness because I think this is what some people get a label and then that can hinder them.
[00:15:01] But actually a label can empower you and that’s awesome. Right. So what, so how did you take it? What happened and, and what, what happens next?
[00:15:08] Leanne Maskell: Yeah. It wasn’t an overnight thing. I actually don’t even remember telling anyone about. Being diagnosed with A DHD. I was like, cool, give me a medication. Like I thought, actually that’s not so bad.
[00:15:19] I thought I was gonna be sectioned in hospital, but I was like, fine, give me your medication. And he said, no, we can’t give you the medication. You’ve got to fill in more forms. And what you mentioned there about the hyperfocus, that’s what you commonly see in people with A DHD. They can do the hard things very easily, but the easy things like filling in a form very, very hard for them.
[00:15:40] So it took me a year to go back and say, okay, I agree with you, gimme your medication. But it was really helpful in that year to be able to see what I was doing and link it back to A DHD and learn more about it, because although I didn’t really resonate with these kind of core symptoms of things like hyperactivity and impulsive and inattention, because my problem was I paid attention too much to the things that weren’t important necessarily.
[00:16:05] Then I went back and I said, yep, okay. Got the site, got the forms done. Like I mentioned, then I was able to then sit down long enough to apply for a job properly and I knew a bit more about myself. I knew I was interested in mental health and I applied for a job at the Law Society and managed to get it, which still blows my mind.
[00:16:25] I was pretty sure it was a mistake. I almost canceled it because I was like, they’re going to be like, you don’t know anything about these areas of law. But actually it worked out really well because my job was working with lots of really intelligent people and asking them for, for the information, but it was quite difficult at first because I was used to being like productive, having something to do all the time.
[00:16:47] I. And in office jobs, you kind of don’t have a lot to do all the time and, and my manager didn’t want me doing all of the things that I did within a month. Like set, tried to set up podcasts and create campaigns for the members and help lawyers. And so then I. I also had to change gp and they told me that the waiting list for A DHD assessments there was seven years long.
[00:17:13] And I was like, what the hell? So then I basically wrote about A DHD. I wrote a book about A DHD and I forgot. I also wrote a book about modeling before them that had done really well. But I just really didn’t want to do modeling. I wanted, I was like, I’ve got a job. I’m gonna do this for the rest of my life, and I’m very happy and this is going to work.
[00:17:30] So in the beginning of that label. Wouldn’t say hindered me, but more gave me that information. And I thought that that was kind of hacking, uh, by working against it and saying, okay, cool. I’m gonna handcuff myself to this job. I cannot quit. And I wrote that book at work, which was actually really helpful for me to have, um, something to do all day that looked like work because I would often do my work in an hour.
[00:17:53] And I also went to a talk by someone where they talked about A DHD, uh, in the workplace. And I couldn’t believe what I was hearing because it was exactly what I was struggling with. Like I struggled with people talking around me, et cetera. So I found, I found that really hard. Like if anything, it was under stimulating and I wanted to do more by.
[00:18:13] Chance coincidence. A friend of a friend was a coach, and I was kind of like, that’s not a real job. Like I was like, you’re like a fake therapist, right? And she was like, no. She’s like, you should talk to a coach if you’re interested in that. And I was like, oh, fine. And talk to her friend who was. What we call a neurotypical coach.
[00:18:32] And she was like, we can help you to do the things you want to do. And I said, no, my problem is I need help not doing the things I want to do. And I was like, I don’t need to do all of these ideas. I need to not do them. And she did not get it. And then I thought maybe there’s such a thing as an A DHD coach.
[00:18:47] Googled her, found this amazing woman and she was the first person I’d ever talked to who also had a DHD. And it was just like a huge light bulb moment for me because at that time I was 26, it was only about seven years ago. There was not information about a DHD on the internet like there is now. It wasn’t a conversation.
[00:19:06] I was like terrified to talk about it publicly to anybody. But having coaching helped me so much because it helped me to understand like, this isn’t a bad thing. Like you mentioned the hyperfocus. It helped me to see like I didn’t have to use that label to f. Kind of forced myself to be normal, but I could actually create my own environment where I could use my strengths.
[00:19:28] And I was fortunate because that coach, she was previously a really successful lawyer, so I could see that I. Theoretically you could survive on this magical job. That seemed to be a real job, actually, and how much it helped me and she, but again, here we have the autism, so I didn’t know that I was autistic.
[00:19:46] And in our first session she said, what do you want to do next week? You need an action. And I was like, oh, I don’t know. And I had written this A DHD book. And I hadn’t touched it for six months because the motivation had gone. And I just thought, oh, she’ll like that. So I said, oh, I’ll publish my A DHD book.
[00:20:03] And she was like, okay, amazing. And then because I’d said that, I took it really literally, and I. Drove myself to the ground for next week, finishing the book, finding all the references, finding out how to self-publish it, and then put it on Amazon. And she was like, amazing. But for me personally, I spent about three weeks crying because I was like, I have just ruined my life.
[00:20:24] Like, why did I do that? I didn’t even mean, I was like, I was just people pleasing this coach, like, um, I don’t even know. And now my career is ruined. And I decided not to mention it again, especially because when I got the book. I put a photo up and I realized that I had misspelled the title as a HD, and they said, I was like, so didn’t mention it, but then I had Microsoft contact me, um, and say, can you come and do a talk?
[00:20:49] Your book is really amazing. And I was like,
[00:20:52] Adam Stott: oh,
[00:20:52] Leanne Maskell: okay. My dad said, that’s a hoax. He was like, don’t reply to them. And I was like, well, well, because what I found in having a job. Is that the novelty? Born off After a few months, I saw people around me that had been there for 20 years and I was like. Do I want to do this in 20 years?
[00:21:10] And I also found it a bit frustrate. I found it really frustrating at how slow things moved in the company compared to what I could do myself. And I, I wanted to like, make change around what I was seeing. So I thought, and particularly around the money as well say, coming from modeling everyone, whenever you tell someone that you are modeled, they’d be like, what are you gonna do after?
[00:21:29] What like, real job are you gonna do? You know, you need financial security. But modeling, I could earn a thousand pounds a day. But in my law job, I was making like two and a half thousand pounds a month after tax, and it was really annoying to see like that would never change, or I’d have to fight really hard for like a thousand pound pay rise a year.
[00:21:48] And so with this Microsoft job, I asked an old model agent to. Negotiate it for me. ’cause I was like, maybe they’ll pay something. And she said, how much do you wanna charge? And I was like, a hundred pounds. And I was like, but they’re not gonna pay me anything. I was like, I’m not like, I was like, you know, this book is just my random ramblings.
[00:22:07] And then she said, no, no. And she charged them one and a half thousand pounds for a talk I did on my lunch break. And then they bought 50 books. I was like, okay, maybe the end that lunch break hour was just the easiest thing ever. I was just talking like, like I’m talking to you now. And that all, all combined led me to basically quit my job, um, during the pandemic.
[00:22:28] And I did this a DH. You quit? Yeah,
[00:22:31] Adam Stott: I quit.
[00:22:31] Leanne Maskell: But on mit I was
[00:22:32] Adam Stott: quit ask. How did it feel when you actually quit though? Did you feel, um. Do you know what’s
[00:22:37] Leanne Maskell: really funny is I had started applying for different jobs ’cause I felt like I wasn’t in the right place anymore. And there was a company called Un Mind and they had a job as a content writer, like a mental health platform.
[00:22:51] And I had a few interviews with them and I got to the final round, me and one other person, and I would’ve took a 10,000 pounds pay cut. But I was like, it’s fine. And then I didn’t get it and I was like, I can’t do that again. No, no, no. I was like, I’m not going for another round of interviews and having managers.
[00:23:10] And I was like, no, I’m gonna quit. And I was like, I’ll work in a shop, I’ll do coaching. I, because that’s the great thing about having done modeling since the age of 13, like. Every year, every month I was like, oh my God, am I gonna make my rent? And then after about five years of doing that full time, I was like, well, I’m, I’ve had the same fear every day and I’ve always been okay.
[00:23:29] You always find something to do. You see that the world is unlimited and you get used to working, you know, doing anything, working really hard, doing catering or whatever it is on the side. So I was like, right. Um, so I just quit and, and also my A DHD coach said that I could work with her, which is probably not the best boundary from her, but, so I started working with her.
[00:23:51] I signed up for this course. And immediately I was just overwhelmed with people. There were many, many people, which we know now that it was just really, really, and so many kids as well that I was coaching. And I found that they did not respond at all to how I was being trained in my course. It’s very, very different and that all led me to create my own company, A DHD works and.
[00:24:16] Since then, it has been completely chaotic. Amazing. It’s grown so, so quickly, but it’s been chaos and, and amazing chaos and incredible to see how we’ve been able to empower people to do the same thing. Like it’s basically taking that control over your life. But I meant to mention, so our mind, when I decided to quit.
[00:24:34] I messaged the co-founder called Steve and I said, you know, I’m gonna start my own business. I knew he was a coach before setting up a mind. And I was like, please, can you mentor me? And I thought, because he is been in quite a few interviews with me, where I just asked him incessant random questions about what he’s doing.
[00:24:50] Maybe he would say yes, and he did. So he mentored me and he was incredibly, incredibly helpful. So it’s a funny story of how it all comes about. ’cause I think when you do become self-employed. You have nothing to lose and then you just put it, all my coach said, you jump and the net shall appear. And she was right.
[00:25:08] Adam Stott: Yeah. Oh, brilliant. So, so now you’ve been running your business and tell us a bit about what you, what you do and how you help people. Now. I think it’d be really interesting for people to hear you’ve got a new book as well about, and I think we should, before we even go into that. Tell us a little bit about the autism side.
[00:25:23] When did you find out about this? You know, how did that affect you? Did you have a new realization? You know, what was the impact of this?
[00:25:32] Leanne Maskell: Yeah, I can actually answer both questions in one. Um, because it was really running the business that helped me to see that because I coached, first of all, I coached a lot of teenagers, which I found really overwhelming because they have less control over their environment.
[00:25:47] And there’s things like school, and I was finding myself like. Worrying about them all the time and a lot of mental health impacts as well. And then the demand for coaching was so huge. It was just me and eventually one, um, virtual assistant and we had hundreds of people on lists like wanting coaching, and there was just me.
[00:26:08] So then. I was like, we could make a course. So I made a course and um, had lots and lots of people doing that, but then they all wanted one-on-one coaching as well, and then I needed to order it. So I made a framework, like something that we could teach to people where they could come and learn how to coach other people.
[00:26:27] And I thought at first of all, okay, great, then we can hire some of these people. So I made it quite expensive. I was like, then I’m not gonna literally give away what I’m doing to, to everyone. And those people will be invested in what they’re doing.
[00:26:40] Adam Stott: Yeah. Great.
[00:26:41] Leanne Maskell: And since then, 500 people have done that course.
[00:26:44] So
[00:26:45] Adam Stott: how much was the course?
[00:26:46] Leanne Maskell: Uh, three and a half thousand pounds.
[00:26:48] Adam Stott: So you’ve got 500 people go for that course. That’s great. Yeah. It’s good to put the price up.
[00:26:55] Leanne Maskell: Yeah, exactly. But it’s funny because it’s like, I didn’t really set out to make money. I, it’s. A huge amount of money, but it’s good for me. I think, again, with modeling, because you just, I live in exactly the same place and have pretty much exactly the same life.
[00:27:12] And so it was a, it’s not really like about the money, which is ironic because the, the world is like. Oh, dare you charge this much money to learn to be an A DHD coach in six weeks. I’m like, I don’t know. People keep buying it. I’m not making them. Basically, the business became extremely successful. We had Disney come and say, can you train up 250 of our mental health first aiders and A DHD coaching skills?
[00:27:35] I made them their own program. It was amazing. But it was all from my bedroom slash studio that I live in. Really, really overwhelming, and I found that. I really couldn’t relate to people in my life anymore, or I was just exhausted by them. And then I was coaching a lot of people with A DHD and autism and started to see, I was like, that’s just normal.
[00:27:54] I was like, that’s what I do. But it’s not necessarily a DHD here, but things like needing instructions and needing like gender and needing the order within the chaos. So, and they were all like, you are, you are artistically. I might, and then, so I had the realization. I understood that about myself, but I was like, there’s no point in getting an assessment and also a family member.
[00:28:18] Actually, both of my parents, I would say are autistic in my opinion, because they exhibit a lot of traits. They’re very different to me. But, so I kind of knew this, I was like, there’s no point in me seeking a diagnosis because first of all, the diagnostic criteria is really based on young boys. Like what you would imagine, I dunno what your son is like, but like, trained, um, you know, introverted and my coping strategies had always been to go out and get drunk and to be the social butterfly and, uh.
[00:28:49] To double book myself with lots of different things and then invite everybody to the same place, then go to the bathroom and hide and hope that they all get on and be like, okay, no time to go home. So for me, that assessment that I knew, like going for the A DHD assessment was really rough and I didn’t really see the point because there is no like medication for autism.
[00:29:11] So it would just be confirming what I already knew. Then, uh, last year, so someone that I worked with really closely, that virtual assistant from the beginning, she left quite out of the bloom and I became really suicidal. And then I wrote her a 55 page book, which was an entirely weird thing to do about.
[00:29:31] Because I was like, okay, I just need to understand why, like how this has happened. Like the exact point at which like, you know, she decided to leave and I was so, so upset because it felt like the business had turned into this massive people pleasing machine. I. And all I wanted to do was work with this person.
[00:29:49] Like I would’ve give, I would actually, I left her over half of the company and my will before she quit. Um, like I would’ve given her the whole company, like, uh, yeah. And so it was those big,
[00:30:01] Adam Stott: you feel like you really enjoyed working with her then.
[00:30:04] Leanne Maskell: It was just having someone that could help me so, so much and we had a really good relationship in that she did all of the admin.
[00:30:11] She kind of understood my brain. She and she really didn’t take advantage of me at all. Whereas I feel like a DHD and autism, it makes you really, really vulnerable where you would just give people anything and then be like, oh, who do have given this person everything and say. It was really difficult and particularly the change in routine because me and this person had worked together like every single day for the two years, and that is what was making it so fun.
[00:30:39] Adam Stott: Yeah,
[00:30:39] Leanne Maskell: I was really crushed and I wanted to close the whole business. I was like, I quit. Everyone around was like, don’t do that. Don’t, don’t quit. Uh, and yeah, and, and then from that point on, I started having really bad panic attacks when I did go outside and when I traveled and. A lot of people invited me on holiday in the summer, and I was like, okay, I’ll go away.
[00:31:00] And I was like, oh, I’ll have fun. I’ll do things and go on holiday. And then when I was on holiday with them, I was like, oh, I cannot stand being around people. Um, I was like, these, like I, I could see in myself, like how I was masking and how I was constantly struggling with like the unstructured time. All of these symptoms of autism, and then it all culminated in coming back from Spain where I had a huge panic attack in the airport.
[00:31:25] ’cause I got lost and trapped in this baggage area and just screamed over and over and over again. I was like, maybe I need help. I saw online someone that had written about autism and the ways that resonated with me. They were like an expert in women in autism, so I just decided to book it and I was like, I have nothing left to lose.
[00:31:44] And I was like, I knew that the A DHD label had helped me so much. So I was like, maybe just getting this diagnosis will help me to understand myself better. And that’s kind of how I wrote this book in the end, because after the diagnosis. I sat at home for 10 days and was like, I need to write out my entire life and understand what is a DHD, what is autism?
[00:32:05] How has it impacted my life? Like, and how can people support others in that position? And like, what kind of support did I need that could have helped me to, you know, struggle less? Because externally I looked like I had everything figured out, but internally I was really, really struggling and. Also when I went for that autism assessment as well, I had a lot of people in my life, particularly like family, say, you are not autistic.
[00:32:32] Why do you want to label? Everyone thinks they’re autistic these days. You are fine. And that was really difficult to handle, especially because I’ve worked in A DHD for like many years, so I knew that. I, I didn’t really expect that from them. So that was how I had to process it. And here we are now.
[00:32:51] Adam Stott: And, and what, how did that benefit you?
[00:32:53] So now, you know, how did that, how did that you Oh, it’s
[00:32:57] Leanne Maskell: amazing actually. It’s, it’s completely changed my life, the autism diagnosis as well as the A DHD because. Yes, A DHD makes me very, very impulsive. Have lots and lots of ideas, seek chaos, but I’ve always been also very ordered. So like I will reply to all of my emails immediately.
[00:33:18] I have to just reply to all of them straight away. I’ve always, they stress me out and I’ve written all of these books, not for. Necessarily other people, but more for myself to process things. ’cause I didn’t really understand how I was feeling, or like A-D-H-D-I was like, I need to get to the bottom of this.
[00:33:34] So it’s made a lot of sense and validation in that way. But also when I look back over my life, it really helped me understand how I’d been into so many. Situations that I previously really blamed myself for, which again, we say it’s not an excuse, it’s an explanation. Yeah. But for example, I have moved in with so many people after dating them for a few weeks.
[00:33:54] Um, but now I can say, oh, it’s because I struggled so much with having that change in routine and adapting to someone else’s routine and knowing how often you’re supposed to see someone. And so moving in with someone was much easier because then you don’t have to worry. Do they still like me? I don’t know.
[00:34:12] Um, but if you’re living with them, it’s, it’s easier, but not necessarily the best dating strategy. I also broke up with someone because I realized it basically, I think the autism diagnosis helped me to see that how I was being taken advantage of in different situations and relationships and to start advocating for myself.
[00:34:31] So I had a lot of parties to go to at the time. And some of them were by people that had kind of dismissed what I was going through, and I just said, I’m not going. I was like, I’ve never done this. I’ve never ever given myself permission to not go into a situation that feels uncomfortable because I would always prioritize other people, but I.
[00:34:52] It enabled me to start listening to my own needs and to start taking them really seriously and to also in that assessment, they told me over and over again how vulnerable I was. I was like, thank you, like what am I meant to do with this information? But it has. It. It really wasn’t expected, but it’s really enabled me to actually start putting that into practice and recognizing that I will give someone anything they want and I will put other people above me.
[00:35:19] So I need to start taking care of myself and not put myself in situations like this and just understand what works for me. It’s been really, really helpful.
[00:35:29] Adam Stott: Yeah. I, I, I think that’s a, you know, an amazing journey and I’m sure many, many, many people will, will resonate with that. If you were to say there was somebody listening that didn’t know they had a DHD, um, we’ll go there first.
[00:35:43] Mm-hmm. Is there any things that you would, any pieces of advice you might give them? Just, you know, a couple of, a couple of tips to. To help them to be able to manage in a slightly different way or some things that they should do to cope with that.
[00:35:55] Leanne Maskell: Ultimately, it’s about self-acceptance and we live in a world now where, at the start of every talk, I do this kind of ten second attention test to see how long you can concentrate.
[00:36:08] People never make it past like five seconds long because we’re living in a world of so much demand on our attention from screens and iPhones. So rather than like obsessing over whether you potentially have or don’t have a DHD, autism, anything else, which can be a really ruminative cycle. Think about what you would do if you did have that diagnosis and start doing that now.
[00:36:32] And I think the main thing for me is that self-acceptance and noticing what your brain is telling you that you should be doing and how you should be living your life. And start actually thinking about what you want to do and playing to your strengths and really recognizing what they are and recognizing the areas that you struggle.
[00:36:53] And instead of trying to force yourself to be good at them, like I will never be able to use an Excel sheet, and that’s okay, but I can find other people that can use Excel sheets. So it’s kind of like living your life on your terms and recognizing that. There’s nothing wrong with you, it’s just that your brain works differently.
[00:37:10] And that’s why entrepreneurs are 300% more likely to start their own business if they have a DHD. So, you know, and that’s why so many of us are really fortunate to have created our own environments, why we can thrive, but recognizing
[00:37:26] Adam Stott: why are they 300% more likely? Is that because the the need for their own environment?
[00:37:31] Leanne Maskell: Yeah, I, I think so. I think it’s combined with a huge number of ideas. Um, many, many ideas, and we can spot those inaccuracies in the areas that need fixing because they don’t work for us. We can, for me personally, it’s having more I impulse to than fear. Um, so before I know what I’ve done, I’ve made a business or I’ve made a call or made a website, I’m like, we’re doing this now.
[00:37:59] We have to do it. That side is the autism bit. So I think the A DHD is the really difficult bit, is sticking to it. We’re more likely to start a business and buy the DONA domain name, but then the running of it is the hard bit and when it becomes normal. So playing to those strengths and finding people that compliment you is really important.
[00:38:19] And I think also what I’ve seen is. Like basically the traditional working world just doesn’t work for neuro neurodivergent brains because we might feel too much or not enough or understimulated or overstimulated. So I do think that a lot of us end up creating our own paths. Um, and I’ve definitely seen that in the people that I’ve trained and it’s, it’s really amazing.
[00:38:40] And I think the biggest thing I try to tell all of them is be yourself. Like, there’s a time called congruence, which is like bringing your, your inner and outer experiences match. And I think everyone that I coach, I’m like, don’t go and just replicate what I’ve taught you, blend it with yourself, like reiki or whatever it is that you love cars.
[00:38:59] Like go and make your own version of this because that’s what the world needs, and if you needed help, it’s very likely that there are people out there that need that help as well. So it’s just trusting your own instincts. Not being afraid to be a bit cringe and judged. Um, giving into your brain that’s telling you like, what if I just get bored of this and I quit this?
[00:39:21] And I just follow it step by step and see where it takes you Because like, I’ve never really had a business plan, but we’re here now. I.
[00:39:29] Adam Stott: Well, well, it’s an amazing journey, an amazing, uh, story. The book that you’ve recently written, which is particularly interesting, you told me is, uh, earlier is a lot about some of the story that we’ve discussed today and, you know, I’m sure a lot deeper.
[00:39:42] And it really talks about the autism side as well as the HHD. What is that new book called? You’ve got that there, you Yeah,
[00:39:50] Leanne Maskell: all DHD blooming differently. So it’s very, it’s a very big book. Um,
[00:39:55] Adam Stott: or the HD.
[00:39:57] Leanne Maskell: I turned down a publisher for, because they wanted me to take out me, basically, and they wanted it to be more of a guide.
[00:40:04] And I was like, no, this is really important. ’cause I think especially parents, they will often tell me like, well, you probably had a really good upbringing or like, you know, you. You’re, you’re doing so well. Why isn’t my child like you? And I was like, no, no, no, no, no. And I was like, also my life the first 26 years were absolute how?
[00:40:25] So I was like, if I can use my experiences, especially to help parents. Like accept that about their kids. ’cause I think their first reaction is often, you know, defensiveness or fear because there is no information for parents or loved ones like that person is going through it themselves, but it also changes all your relationships with everyone else in your life.
[00:40:44] So I felt that was really important to share. And that’s the books and that’s basically my life. That I wrote out in 10 days and I just published it, it seems to have come down Well,
[00:40:53] Adam Stott: brilliant. So people can go find that on Amazon. Yeah. Is that the best place for ’em to get it? Yeah. Yeah. Well, look, um, big thank you for coming on.
[00:41:00] Uh, Leanne. I think there’s, there’s a lot there that can really help people and, uh, I, I know, you know, firsthand the amount of entrepreneurs and people that have. You know, these types of symptoms, these types of situations, these types of struggles, I’m sure it will help a lot of people out there. And if you found lots of value in this today as you’ve been listening along, make sure you go and hit the three dots and share this with somebody you know that find some value there.
[00:41:24] You know, perhaps you know somebody that’s had. Some similar struggles. Uh, that is the way that this podcast grows. So go and share it, give somebody else an opportunity to, uh, learn. Thanks again, Leanne, for coming on. It’s been a great episode and, uh, yeah, it’s been absolutely amazing. Thanks again and I look forward to seeing you all very soon.