Episode 316: Building a Purpose-Driven Business with Jeff Dewing
Starting a business with genuine intentions, such as addressing a problem, enhances the likelihood of achieving success. It is crucial to recognize the significance of establishing a purpose-driven business and making a positive impact on people’s lives.
Jeff Dewing talks with Adam Stott and shares his entrepreneurial journey and the ups and downs he faced along the way. From starting his own business in the refrigeration industry to building a multi-million pound company, Jeff discusses the importance of finding purpose in business and help solving problems in the society. He also talks about the impact of COVID-19 on his business and how he navigated through the challenges.
Jeff Dewing, the author of “Doing the Opposite” and CEO of Cloud FM, has overcome obstacles and achieved success through resilience and determination. After experiencing bankruptcy, he started a new business from his garden shed and turned it into a £70M turnover. Despite setbacks from Covid, he is projected to make £250M by 2026. Jeff’s mission is to share his knowledge and insights to help others.
Jeff Dewing’s journey in the business world is a testament to the power of purpose, resilience, and integrity. His story serves as an inspiration for aspiring entrepreneurs, highlighting the importance of finding meaning in business and staying true to one’s values. By embracing challenges, adapting to change, and fostering strong relationships, Jeff has built a successful business that continues to make a positive impact in the industry.
Show Highlights:
- Why starting a business for the right reasons, such as solving a problem, increases the chances of success
- Building a strong culture and focusing on transparency and integrity can transform an industry
- Communication is crucial in business, and it is important to be honest and transparent with clients and suppliers
- Taking risks and doing the opposite of what is expected can lead to innovation and success
- Importance of learning and gaining knowledge
Links Mentioned:
Check out Jeff Dewing’s book Doing the Opposite, and Doing the Opposite: Business Disruptors podcast,
Get your Business Growth Secrets SUCCESS PLANNER for FREE and profit like a pro: https://adamstottplanner.com/free-book47315172
Adams website: https://adamstott.com/?el=Pod
Watch the Episode on Adam’s YouTube Channel: https://www.youtube.com/adamstottcoach?el=Pod
Connect with Adam on Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/adamstottcoach/?el=Pod
Join Adam’s network on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/adam-stott-coach/?el=Pod
Business owners: Monetise social media, get more clients, increase your following, and make more sales: https://socialmediamonetisation.com/unlockfb?el=Pod
Coaches, Consultants, and Speakers: lower your marketing costs, increase ticket prices, and get more high-ticket clients: https://personalbrandunlocked.com/fb-event-reg?el=Pod
Transcript:
Please note this is a verbatim transcription from the original audio and therefore may include some minor grammatical errors.
[00:00:00] Adam Stott: Hello everybody and welcome to this very, very special episode of Business Grows Secrets. I’ve got an amazing guest with me today who’s got an incredible story and has accomplished some amazing things. We’re going to talk about the writing of his book becoming a number one bestseller. We’re going to talk about his podcast launch and also the ups and downs of business.
[00:00:22] He’s built a multi multi million pound business, which has gone and become very, very successful from being just, uh, his, with him, his wife and, uh, starting the business to then growing over to 400 members of staff, um, on a consistent basis. What I love about this story and this journey is there’s lots of ups and downs, and I think it’s really going to open up and provide some great business lessons and some great Business nuggets for everyone that’s listening.
[00:00:51] So a big welcome to the podcast, who Jeff doing, how are you doing my friends?
[00:00:57] Jeff Dewing: Very well, Adam. Thanks very much. And thank you for taking the time to speak with me today.
[00:01:01] Adam Stott: Yeah I’m really, I’m really, really excited. And, you know, a really, really, uh, empowering, empowering story. And you’re obviously at this place now where you’ve built a fantastic business.
[00:01:12] Um, which is as we spoke about previously, potentially valued at the 250 to 300 million mark. Uh, you built that very, very successfully. Had your book launch, your podcast launch, done lots of really cool stuff. But if we were to go back and we were to go back to the beginning of your business journey, we’ve got a lot of people that listen to the podcast that are early stages of business.
[00:01:33] They’re navigating the ups and downs. Their beliefs are often challenged. They’re sometimes got, they’ve got self doubt. And obviously as entrepreneurs, we’ve been through these types of ups and downs and love to have a conversation. Where did it all start for you, Jeff? And what did that look like?
[00:01:49] Jeff Dewing: I guess it all started for me in almost exactly the same way as it starts for anybody, especially if you’re a young entrepreneur.
[00:01:55] And, um, and, and I went on the same journey as most people. I wanted my freedom. I wanted to manage my destiny. I didn’t want to be managed for me. Um, And I always knew mainly because my father run his own business all of his life, um, as well and done okay. Um, and I just knew that that was the freedom I wanted, but the reason I started the business, why most people is that I wanted to earn more money and, um, I wanted the financial security and whatever.
[00:02:23] Um, so I’m, I embarked on that journey where the only ambition was, how do I make enough money that I don’t have to worry about money? And, um, and what I learned in life is there’s three reasons people start a business. Um, one is. Because we’re unemployable. Two is because I want to make shit loads of money.
[00:02:41] Or three is they want to solve a problem. And if you start a business for the first two reasons, there’s a 95 percent chance you’re going to fail. If you start the business for the third reason, a purpose, you know, uh, solving a problem for society, to what extent that is, there’s a 90 percent chance you’ll succeed because you’re doing it for the right reasons.
[00:02:59] And it takes a lot of to realize that because we all think it’s about finding a niche in the market, or an opportunity to earn a load of money, um, and self serve. That’s why most, so I went on that same journey and I suffered the same challenges that I was lucky enough, my business lasted 10 years before it crashed, but it crashed because I lost interest.
[00:03:17] It wasn’t purpose driven. And um, and, and essentially ended up sort of dust on the ground.
[00:03:23] Adam Stott: And, and what business, it’s really interesting that you, you say those three things and, and I know when we had a, a chat prior, in our conversations prior that you really talked about. That making money angle. And I certainly would say that’s why I first went into business.
[00:03:39] But what I do now is for very, very different reasons and certainly falls into that third category and that passion stays up, doesn’t it? So I totally resonate with what you’re saying. Um, and, and a lot of people do that. They, they, they start a business cause they can’t work for somebody else. They start a business to make money and then they, they realize that sometimes they build something that they don’t love.
[00:04:00] So, so what was that first business for you? What was it that you started off doing?
[00:04:04] Jeff Dewing: So I left school at 16 with no qualifications. Um, and I was a doer, I was very ambitious. Don’t know why, um, it was just inbuilt into me. And I went into a very unique industry. When you went to your career’s office in school, you was either, you know, do you want to be a bricklayer or a plumber?
[00:04:20] Um, a plasterer, you know, all the usual stuff that you get in a career’s office. And I said, no, I want to be a fish engineer. And they said, well, that’s a fish engineer. Um, and it was also because my father had been a fridge engineer and he said to me once, um, you’ll never find a good fridge engineer out of work because it’s in such high demand and it’s highly technical.
[00:04:36] But no one knew anything about refrigeration. No one knew what made those fridges insanely cold. So I embarked on that journey, got an apprenticeship, um, and I started learning about refrigeration and went to college over it as well and suddenly my learning come alive where I wasn’t that particularly interested in learning at school.
[00:04:51] I was, I was a jack, I was a jack of all martial and that, but suddenly the, the need for education hit me when I was sort of 16, 17 going to, to day release college and, um. Then the practicality of working on the equipment four days a week as well, so it just ignited me, I guess. And I think once you got over the boring bit where you’re the T boy as an apprentice and you start to do stuff, then it suddenly starts to become enjoyable.
[00:05:14] And then I just saw the people in my business that I was working for, there’s 50, 60, 70 guys been there 25, 30 years, all doing the same thing, almost no progression. Um, and I just stood up one day in the canteen and said, By the time I’m 19, I’m going to be supervisor. And they all laughed at me, clipped me around the ear, and told me to shut up and go and get a cup of tea.
[00:05:32] And, um, anyway, I decided I was going to be a supervisor. These guys have been here 30 years and never made supervisor, but it’s quite a responsible role. And I just laser focused on it. And by the time I was 19, I was given a company card, big announcement, I made supervisor. The young supervisor in the history of the company that was 200 years old.
[00:05:48] So that’s when I realized that when you set your goals, you can achieve whatever you want to achieve. Uh, but you, but you’ve got to be, you’ve got to have the grit and determination. So that was the first exposure I had to understanding that you, you, you can, you can do whatever you want to do if you focus on it.
[00:06:01] And then very quickly, um, in refrigeration, you work silly hours. I was doing a hundred hours a week, loved it. Um, because I love the job, but it was, it was a hundred hours a week. So I got married young at 19, got divorced at 22 because those hours will just kill any relationship. And, um, And then I decided that I need to calm down.
[00:06:18] So I met another lady who’s now, uh, has been my partner now for 38 years. And, um, she said to me, he knocked all his hours on the head. So I had to find something local and something that didn’t come on the hour. So I went into, um, and I only knew what I knew. So she said to me, look, I found this job, it’s a manager, um, managing refrigeration air conditioning.
[00:06:38] I said, but I’m not a manager, I’m an engineer. What do I know about sitting behind a desk? I don’t, you know, I applied for the job and got it. And I had to. Bear in mind, I was only probably 22 then and 23 and they said to me, we want you to build this business from zero to a million pound turnover installing air conditioning.
[00:06:57] So I said, yeah, no problem at all. Um, they said, you can design air conditioning and contracts. And I said, yeah, yeah. Project manager. Yeah. I’ll do that. I wish I’d Couldn’t do any of it. I had no idea. So I had to learn fast. Um, so I blagged my way into it and then had to learn very, very quickly. And another saying I love, um, you know, bite off more than you can chew and learn very quickly how to chew it.
[00:07:16] So, um, anyway, cut my story short. It was all manual then days. It was T cards, bits of paper and paper invoices and typewriting and all the bits that you’d imagine. And, um, and I thought this, this can’t work. So I went and bought an Mstread 1640 computer with two floppy inch disks. And I thought, how do I make this work in this modern world?
[00:07:33] And I switched it on, and all I saw was a C prompt. And I’m going, what does this do then? So anyway, I had no idea. So I phoned my old man up and said, Dad, I’ve got this computer, it don’t work, don’t do nothing. Well, he said, no, you’ve got to put a program in it, son. You’ve got to install a program. I said, OK.
[00:07:46] Anyway, so I learned that very quickly. And then I automated or digitized the entire process that we were using in paper.
[00:07:56] I did it And I suddenly had this, this installation project management automated. I had the service and maintenance automated where it’s all being done digitally and quickly. Everyone could see it. And I went to the business and I said, um, right. I’ve hit a million quid, as you’ve asked. I’ve also digitized all the processes.
[00:08:12] Have a look at this. Um, I said, but there’s one thing I need in return. They said, what’s that? I said, well, I bought this computer a year ago for 900 quid, which meant I’ve missed a month’s mortgage. So for a year, I’ve been a month behind my mortgage. I’d like you to buy the computer. All my time setting it all up is all free.
[00:08:26] I did it in my own time. Um, and obviously the computer will sit here and we can run the business. They went, no. Don’t want to buy a computer. So I said, okay. Um, so I took it home. And then a week later, they said to me, where’s the computer? I said, well, I’ve switched it off. We’re going back to TCards. And they said, oh, why are you doing that?
[00:08:41] So we didn’t buy the computer. So, uh, at that point I realized there was no future because they made it clear they didn’t want to grow any further. And that I’ve got all this information, all this knowledge, all this technology I’ve just built. It’s time to start my own business. I was 23. So I did. And that business grew from zero to 5 million installing air conditioning, um, grew from zero to 5 million with no money.
[00:09:02] Um, in about the first three years, living like kings, big cars, big houses, thought I’d nailed it, still working stupid hours and, um, uh, and that was it. And then after about six or seven years, when I couldn’t get it beyond 5 million, I thought I’ve got to employ better people than me, which I did. I started bringing people out of the corporate world.
[00:09:20] I had incredible experience. One of them used to be head of COO for NetWaste Bank and all sorts of stuff. And, um. And those people, and I brought them in on stupid salaries, much, much higher than me, delivered the square root of zero. And I just, I just got so, so, familiar story, right? Yeah. Yeah. Um, so I then obviously changed that thing and I just couldn’t find the people.
[00:09:41] So I got bored. Um, I just got totally bored and fell out of love with the business. Um, and on reflection, You know, knowing what I know now, at that point, I would have got rid of the business, sold the business, but I didn’t at that time. Yeah. And, um, a couple of my colleagues that were working with me, who were great, I said, look, here’s your chance to run a business, um, on board, I’m going to go do something else.
[00:10:00] I went and bought a football club, um, left them to run the business, which they did. And, um, a Claxton Town Football Club, semi professional. Nice. Uh, in Essex. And, um, they hadn’t, yeah, lovely little club. Yeah, they hadn’t won anything for 60 years. There was a little bit of the laughing stock of the town and, um, and I decided I want to get them to win stuff.
[00:10:24] So, um, I did a lot of stuff, leveraged all my supplies to get them to advertise with the club and all the other And, um. And then suddenly, in the five years that I had it, we won a trophy every single year. Um, we got promoted three times, we was on Sky Sports, we just, we just hit these highs that was incredible because it was the same group of players that won nothing and now winning everything.
[00:10:44] And that’s when I learned that I had this ability, which I didn’t know before, I had this ability to bring people together, to get them to run through brick walls. Um, So the motivational side of stuff and the inspirational side of stuff, I noticed this ability to do that, which I didn’t, I had no idea about before.
[00:11:00] Um, but unfortunately in the five years I was running that club, um, after the fourth year, I got a phone call from my, um, MD that was running the business said, Jeff, I need to see you. We’ve run out of cash. So when I looked at it, I said, what do you mean? So he told me, um, and it was through, um, lack of people in the construction industry, getting paid with a nightmare, as most people know.
[00:11:20] Um, and, uh, I said, well, how has this happened? Why didn’t you wave the white flag sooner? Well, we thought we could trade out of it. We thought this, we thought that. So I then buried my head back in the business for the next three weeks to realize that it was in such a state, um, it was unrecoverable, um, which was entirely my fault, entirely my responsibility.
[00:11:39] And, um, so I had no choice. When realizing the situation, then, then to, after getting the specialist into, you know, advising to validate what I thought, um, and, uh, we had to, I had to move into bankruptcy and, um, I guess the only saving grace I had from that, which was about my values being brought up as a kid was the most important thing about whatever I did was that I had to ensure every credit was paid, which every credit got paid.
[00:12:05] So that was the one thing that was positive out of the next experience. Um, so yeah, I had to declare bankruptcy and I was very. Very well known figure in the town because everybody knew me because the football club and socialization, stuff like that. So I was having to walk down the high street into job seekers to sign on, which I’d never done in my life.
[00:12:23] Um, and people will watch me do that. And it nearly killed me because of, you know, you’re this, you’re this guy full of pride, proud of what you’ve done. Everyone was always talking about your success and so on and so on and so on. Um, and it nearly destroyed me because I’d let the family down, let the kids down, lost my house, lost the cars, lost everything.
[00:12:40] And, um, and I went hiding. It is the lowest point of my entire life. And, um, yeah, I wouldn’t ever want to go through that again.
[00:12:49] Adam Stott: Yeah. And it’s very, very transparent, very, very honest about the impact of what can happen. And I love the fact that you say, look, I took pretty much took my off the ball and went in a different direction.
[00:13:03] I think that will resonate with a lot of people. You know, I’ve been through very similar things to exactly what you just said personally. And I know exactly what that’s like. Um, like the fact that you got to the point where you had to walk into a job seekers and, and that must’ve been really tough. So I can totally see how that would have impacted you.
[00:13:23] So what did you, and I think this is really important for the audience that are listening. And, you know, because the comeback is, is even more important, right? What did you do with your mindset? So, first of all, you have to swallow your pride hard to go and, go and do that, right? To go into job seekers, you have to have people looking at you that used to admire you, now all of a sudden talking about you in a negative way.
[00:13:45] So, so your back’s against the wall and you’ve got to now restore your self belief. What, do you remember specifically what you did? To rebuild yourself in those moments.
[00:13:59] Jeff Dewing: Um, the quick answer to that is no. Um, The long answer or longer answer is that, you know, I did actually go hiding. Um, I became a recluse for about nine months.
[00:14:15] Not knowing where to turn and what really drove that was one particular day My wife had said to me Jeff look, can you go out and get some bread and some beans? We got to give the kids beans on toast for tea tonight. There’s nothing in the cupboards So I said, yeah, no problem darling went to the ATM and there was seven pounds sixty air count and it would only dispense ten pound So I couldn’t even get money out for beans on toast So it got really dire and that was the real clear moment says Jesus.
[00:14:39] What am I gonna do now? And I felt sorry for myself I felt low And lucky enough, I don’t suffer with what, you know, some people obviously do with depression, but if, if there was an, if there was an explanation or a word for it, it would have been depression. But, and then I just, I just kept sitting in the garden shed, looking at the ceiling thinking, you know, what do I do?
[00:15:01] Because the one thing that everybody seeks, I guess, in that scenario is you want to be able to flick a switch and everything’s okay. What can I do today that will make tomorrow okay? And then after about nine months, it was just that realization that said, It doesn’t matter what I do today or tomorrow, short of winning the lottery, which you have to discount because that’s not going to happen.
[00:15:21] Um, this is going to take time to get you back to where you started, let alone where you finished. So you just got to start one day at a time. And the one thing I did one particular day where I sat down, I’m looking at the ceiling like I did a lot. And I just said, what am I going to do? How am I going to get there?
[00:15:38] What’s the journey look like? And it was a famous saying I use a lot now in my keynotes is how do you eat an elephant? And it’s one buyer at a time. So you’ve got to take that first step. But what was the thing I needed to do? Well, what I, what I was really clear on, because that was the reflections for the nine months was that all the time I’ve been successful, um, and when you run a business, you’ll know this, you know, you become an IT specialist, you become an HR specialist, you become a solicitor, you become an accountant, you have to learn all these trades, right?
[00:16:05] So Unless you do it and you’re successful, you do believe you know it all. You do believe there’s nothing anyone can teach me. You know, don’t teach me. I’m more successful than you sort of attitude. Um, which was a level of arrogance. It was one of the, one of the failings of the business and me as a human being.
[00:16:22] But. So on that reflection I realized I’ve got to start, but what I had shitloads to learn because I knew the square root of nothing. My knowledge was insignificant to what it needed to be. So the only way to get that knowledge was to bury yourself into that environment where you could obtain that knowledge.
[00:16:37] So I decided to go back to the working environment. Some would say I did it because I needed to survive. And there’s that part that’s true. But the real reason I did it was I needed to learn what I’d got wrong. What, what was it? I didn’t know. So I started working for owner managed, owner managed business at 10, 15 million.
[00:16:51] I then stepped up to another one at 60 odd million, then another one at 200 million. And then I went in the corporate world with a business that was one and a half billion. Although I met great people, lots of great people, I realized that the chaos was 10 times worse than I’d ever imagined it would be, even at the biggest businesses.
[00:17:08] When you expect it to be slick and they’ve got money and they’ve got infrastructure, they were more chaotic than I’ve ever seen in my life. So during the journey of meeting, learning lots and lots of lessons, um, and also meeting some great people, I realized that there was something materially wrong with our industry, which is a 200 billion pound industry in the UK.
[00:17:29] And I realized that I believed I could fix it. I believe I could solve that problem. And I then spent the next three years with a clear vision of I’m going to solve this problem. So what do I need to do to solve this problem? And I use my experience and knowledge and time with these companies to really nail down how I was going to solve this problem.
[00:17:49] And without even realizing too much later in life, what was now doing was I was looking at big starting a business that was Going to be purpose driven as opposed to searching for money. And, and it just changed everything. The passion was up there. The drive was up there. Nothing was going to stop me.
[00:18:03] Don’t know how many times people would knock me down. I got back up. And, um, and the reason I, I worked for, for six years in, in four different businesses was because I couldn’t hold a job for more than two years. Because I was too disruptive. I was a pain in the ass because I’m saying we’re doing this wrong.
[00:18:18] Why are we doing it this way? Why are we not doing the right thing? Why are we, why are we in a win, lose environment? Why are we not playing a win, win environment? And, um, anyway, eventually I become such a that they’d ask me to leave. And, you know, that’s how I earned a lot of money as well. People asking me to leave.
[00:18:31] But anyway, so, um, so, so I did that. And then eventually we said, right, it’s this time now it’s time to fix this problem. So that was a journey that took me up to starting cloud. Absolutely. And the problem? The problem is that the industry employ one in seven people in the working population, working facilities management, people don’t realize the size of the industry, and it’s full of great people behaving badly, great people behaving badly, and they’re behaving badly, not because they’re bad people, because they’re working in a bad environment, you know, there’s, there’s a lot, this sounds a bit too aggressive, but there’s only one way to explain it, you’ve got it.
[00:19:13] Huge hundreds of thousands of people in the FM industry, certainly a senior level lying and cheating their way through life because that’s the way they’re taught to do it. And that’s the only way to do it. So I’ll give you one example. When you’re in a corporate business, the most important thing in a corporation in almost every single case is hitting your numbers.
[00:19:31] You’ve got to read your numbers, right? You’ve got your forecast, you’ve got your quicks, um, and, uh, and so on and so on. What is the, you know, and if you don’t, if you’ve got a turnover on a 10 million quid in the month of June, and you’ve only turned over 9. 1, even in the corporate world, that’s a sackable offence.
[00:19:47] You don’t need your 10 million, it’s non negotiable. So what do people do? They use a great tool called work in progress. So, um, yeah, it’s 9. 2, but I’ve actually got 900 grand work in progress. Oh, great. So you’ve enumbered it. Yes, we have. But of course that 900 grand doesn’t exist. And then eventually it catches up on you.
[00:20:04] And that was a downfall of Carillion. Carillion that went pop when there’s a direct result of that. So, and that was about. If you didn’t do that, you lost your job. So people had to behave that way because that was the way you had to behave to survive. And that was also the way you was taught. You did business.
[00:20:21] People then believe that’s how you do business. And of course, it’s not how you do business. Um, so I had to solve that problem. How do I, how do I change the industry to behave in? Um, in an honest way with integrity, humility, and just be transparent because nothing was transparent. Everyone was lying and cheating to solve a problem.
[00:20:40] Not because they’re bad people, but you know, the client would say, if you don’t tell me, if you don’t fix this problem in the next three days, I’m cancelling the 10 million pound contract. So people don’t have to lie and cheat just because they’re focusing on saving the contract, not solving the problem.
[00:20:54] And therefore you get this, this environment just gets, becomes toxic. Um, and the entire industry for my journey of six or seven years working these companies, I saw exactly the same thing in every single company without exception. And that was the bit that I was going to solve. Like, how do I get the industry working in a, in an honest way?
[00:21:13] Um, and, and that was it. And then when I decided it was time to start Cloud, I sat down, stared at the scene again for about four days, five days, thought, how am I going to solve this problem? Um, and because I was a, I’m a coder, I can write technology, I can solve loads of stuff in that environment, but I decided technology wasn’t the answer.
[00:21:30] Technology was the enabler, but it wasn’t going to solve the problem. And it sort of dawned on me that you’ve got to change the culture. We’ve got to behave in a completely different way that says, look, Mr. Client, I’ve really cocked up here. Um, I’m really sorry about it. And if you help me, we can solve this problem and get stronger going forward.
[00:21:47] But the idea of telling a client you’ve got it wrong. Was something that couldn’t even be considered in the current, in the current industry, just you can’t do that because you’ll, you’ll lose a contract and there’s too much to lose. Um, and I want to create the environment of culture and I use the technology to do that by creating technology that couldn’t be edited, changed, deleted or hidden.
[00:22:08] So that whatever happened, you might not like what you see, but you know it’s the truth. And that stimulated confidence beyond belief. And then suddenly clients didn’t change because clients were, you know, as much to blame because of their demands and expectations. And then we’ve got the clients to actually behave differently as well.
[00:22:23] Before you knew where you were, the industry wasn’t talking about, you know, value engineering and an EBITDA. That was all talking about transparency, um, visibility, integrity. So we changed the entire language of the industry. Um, And that was the, that was the journey we went on.
[00:22:40] Adam Stott: And that in turn got the confidence of the clients and then allowed you to really grow that business.
[00:22:46] Right? So this, this particular business that we’re talking about cloud, what was the journey of that? So going through that process from start up, what sort of revenues did you do? Uh, were there challenges? Were there some moments where you thought, yeah, were you ever actually a really good question for that is did you ever questioned the mission?
[00:23:05] Jeff Dewing: Never ever questioned the mission. Um, I only ever questioned whether Yeah. the size of the challenge was too big. Um, but then things like that never fazed me for some reason. I don’t know why I I never, ever doubted the, the ability to do it.
[00:23:21] Adam Stott: You were totally done. And this is the right way. Yeah. This is what we are going to do and what we’re going to accomplish.
[00:23:27] And you transferred that confident. I think that’s a lovely message for the people that are actually listening because You know, confidence is transferable. And if you have that utter confidence in what you’re doing, that is going to transfer over to other people, right? And they’re going to believe because you believe, right?
[00:23:43] Jeff Dewing: Well, of course. Yeah. Well, that’s the passion that becomes infectious, right? And I think, and it then brings me onto how we’ve built the incredible culture we’ve got today, because we asked one question when people come into our business, do you believe what, do you believe what we believe? Because if you don’t believe what we believe, then there’s no point in coming here, because it’s pointless.
[00:24:02] You have to believe what we believe. So, the star cloud was… The first thing I had to do was build a technology, which I did. I tested it in the companies that I was working in, in the later part of that six years. So I implemented it into the job roles I had because I was seeing, I was, you know, C suite directors in these businesses.
[00:24:20] So I was, I was implementing this technology to check its validity and more importantly, the way humans engage with it. Cause that had to be, that had to work obviously. And then I guess. Once I’d realized its power, not its power because it was, it was a better piece of technology than anybody else, but it was a way in which it drew people into its use, people just wanted to get involved and engage with it.
[00:24:45] And that’s what meant everything run through that process. So you had a solid process. Once I’d realized that worked, I then said, well, I’ve got to really put this to the test. So we went to a company, um, which most people will know, um, charity organization called, um, Age UK. And they had 600 shops that were just charity shops, and in a charity environment, they don’t invest because they can’t, they don’t get enough money, so it’s all sticky plaster stuff.
[00:25:07] But they were spending two and a half million quid a year on keeping these business, these shops open in terms of broken windows or electrics failing or whatever. So I went to them and said, how many people you got managing this estate? And they said 11 people. So I said, well, I can do it with one person and this technology.
[00:25:25] Um, and the only thing I’m going to charge you, um, is for one person’s salary, you know, to pay for technology or anything, because all I want to do is prove the concept. So basically they bought into it, um, in the first year we reduced their spending from 1. 9 million down to about 850 grand, and we held it at 850 grand for five years.
[00:25:45] And it was just my wife working 24 hours a lot of the out of our stuff. But, um, but one person ran that entire estate, which means they could redeploy 11 people. That was the validation that I needed that this really can work. And also the fact that I now had a, an advocate in, in Age UK that was prepared to shout at the rooftops.
[00:26:05] So that then convinced me it was time to, to, to launch the business, which we did. We then went pounding the pavements to find our first client. And we found our first client, which was Republic Clothing. They had about 120 odd shops. Um, and they were spending a million quid a year. So we’ve now got a million pound turnover managing all of this stuff for their shops on our technology, which was brand new to the industry.
[00:26:25] No one had really seen this type of technology before. And then, um, unfortunately, within two years, Republic went bust, um, and, um, owing us about, somewhere just shy of about half a million quid, six hundred grand, which I thought, that’s it, doors are shut already, we can’t carry on, we’re in deep, deep shit here, and at that point, we were negotiating with, um, Um, about a fully comprehensive contract, which we didn’t like as fully comprehensive is a win lose environment.
[00:26:55] Somebody wins, somebody loses, but we were in this situation that said, well, it’s either that or the door’s closed. So we took on we took on prep reluctantly. And, um, that essentially replaced the losses that we’ve had. So that enables us to trade through it. So for the first two years, we were turning over about a million quid because prep was not just similar.
[00:27:16] So I’m only about 1. 3 and then we built our structure. We’ve worked out what we wanted. We now knew that we could keep the lights on. And, uh, we went for gold and we were talking to, and we had a philosophy of a small number of large clients. We weren’t going to secure every client that wanted us. We were looking for a small number of large clients that helped us prove the principle.
[00:27:38] Create the credibility of our offering. Um, and then from 2013 or 2014 to 2017, we grew from the million to just shy of 80 million winning household names like Peace Express, K F C, um, monsoon Accessorize and, and various other people. So it just, it just launched because the impact we could have on them. K F C was spending 13 million a year.
[00:28:03] Um, in the first year with us, they spent 10, they spent 10 million. So it was quite, it was quite massive. Um, and that was the story of, of what happened, but it was passion purpose driven. It wasn’t chasing the money. The money was a byproduct of solving the problem.
[00:28:19] Adam Stott: So there’s loads of things I love about that, but just for the audience, I wanna, I wanna pick up on a couple of key points.
[00:28:26] First of all, you went out and got a case study testimonial and pretty much worked for free. And, and that is a great way for people actually to get started because if you can’t go out and launch a product and get great people on, but you can go and get a big name to endorse you, that’s going to open a lot of doors.
[00:28:44] So I think that’s a great, great moment there. The second thing, which I think is awesome is that you actually then went out and really looked for a small number of high ticket clients, high value contracts versus trying to take everybody on. Which is working smarter rather than harder. And then that then gave you the roll off effects of being able to get into these big companies, influence these different people.
[00:29:07] So there’s some really, really good lessons there. And that’s not necessarily the end of the story though, right? Because what happens next is, is COVID came in, right? How did that impact the business and what was that challenge like, uh, for you being for all the ups and downs you’ve been through, you kind of got to the point where you built a good business, built some brand and got well known.
[00:29:27] went all the way to the bottom, can’t buy the beans type mentality to then working for six years, building your way up, building your way up, getting back to being successful. And then you took another big right hook. How did that impact you?
[00:29:43] Jeff Dewing: Um, yeah, well, I mean, there’s a little bit of a build up before then, because we got to 2019.
[00:29:50] And we’ve grown massively quickly. And I then decided that, look, we’ve got to stop selling. So I shut down all sales for new clients because I, using an allergy, it was building a block of flats, right? And we’ve got up to the 17th floor and now I can feel the, I can feel the block swaying. So we had to stop, go back and check the foundations before we put any more floors on.
[00:30:10] Um, so I shut sales down for a year while we all went back and said, right, what bad habits we picked up as we’ve grown with all these people we’ve now employed, et cetera, et cetera. We need to solidify that first. So we got to, um, December, 2019. And I said, right, we’re all done. Turn the gas on. Let’s go sell, put some more floors on.
[00:30:29] And then March, 2020. Obviously the world changed. So, um, and I’ll never forget. I flew out. So we had a hat. We’ve got a house in Portugal and I flew out for a week’s holiday because on the, um, we were going for a process of getting some investment, which we’d never done before. A whole business was built on no cash, no overdraft and no investment.
[00:30:51] How do we grow? From 1 million to 70 million with no investment. There’s a million dollar question. How do you think we grew from 1 million to 75, 76 million without any cash?
[00:31:04] Adam Stott: From profit generation, right?
[00:31:10] Jeff Dewing: I’ll tell you one thing that I learned in my journey, because maintenance FM is, is, is in the same break as a construction industry. Getting paid is a nightmare and negotiating payment terms is a nightmare, right? If you’re really lucky, you get 30 days, but typically you get 60, 90 or even 120 days. So all you do is you spend 90 percent of your time managing money and not solving the problem.
[00:31:31] And I swore that would never happen to me again, because that was the life I’d lived in my own business. And it was the life I was living in all the businesses I was working with. And again, part of the, part of the journey I went on and said, I can’t do this again. I had to solve that problem. So what we did was I decided, and everyone thought when I said this, everyone thought I had two heads, um, we’re not going to give our clients credit.
[00:31:54] And again, what? So we negotiated with KFC and KFC said, well, now we’re down to the final bits, payment terms. We normally pay in 60 days. Um, and uh, hopefully that’s okay. I said, 24 hours. And they said, we can’t do 24 hours, no one’s ever done 24 hours before, don’t be ridiculous. So we said, well, unfortunately that’s, that’s a non negotiable and it’s not something we can even talk about.
[00:32:18] It’s 24 hours or nothing. Um, but we obviously took them on a journey as to why that worked and why it was important and so on and so on. But the beauty of it was, because we, the, we, the product we had was in such high demand that we made it a deal breaker and we was prepared for it to be a deal breaker that the clients agreed because of the value they’re getting the other side of it.
[00:32:36] Um, but of course we didn’t pay our suppliers for 45 days. So we had negative working capital. So that’s how we grew, you know, our clients were our investors. And that’s the same, that is true as it is today. And the inspiration I had behind that was Dell computers. When you used to buy a Dell computer, you went online, you decided, you built what you wanted, you paid for it there and then you didn’t get it for six weeks.
[00:32:59] Yeah. And so that was the inspiration everyone thought was mad, but when we pushed it through, that was the reason we was able to grow borrowings and so on and so on. So that kept us in good stead throughout our whole journey. And it also meant that we never spent any time chasing money. So our entire focus was on solving the problem.
[00:33:19] And we then hit COVID. The downside to having a small number of large clients is each one of those large clients makes a big chunk of your turnover, right? So therefore by default, you’ve got high risk. Um, and 90 percent of our clients were in the fast food industry, restaurants, KFC, et cetera, et cetera.
[00:33:39] And when COVID hit, we’d come out to, um, Portugal and we just secured some investment for, for another product, which we’ll talk about later that was going to launch this into the stratosphere. And we were 10 days away from receiving a 35 million pound check. And. It was being signed on the 28th of March.
[00:33:59] I came out here around about the 12th of March for a week’s holiday ahead of… Going into this, um, receipt of money and all the changes we’d be making, um, to get a week’s break to recharge, to go back anyway, it was out here, COVID hit, um, on the sixth day of being out here, the investors confirmed that because of COVID and what’s going on, they’ve got to pull out.
[00:34:19] So that stopped. So that obviously had a few tears over that, and then, um, and then we got stuck in Portugal, um, and because they’d locked down the airports, et cetera, et cetera. So I’m now in Portugal, the business is in the UK. Um, and the next problem we had was that we were collecting six and a half million quid a month.
[00:34:38] Um, and it fell off a cliff and went down to about 200 grand. Everybody shut their checkbooks because of the uncertainty. We don’t know what’s going to happen. All the restaurants are shut. Um, you know, we got all these problems and blah, blah, blah. So, of course, what do you do? Two choices. You go legal and aggressive to see what you can achieve.
[00:34:59] Um, which means even if you do achieve something in the short term, you’ve certainly ruined your long term relationship. Um, or do you show true humanity and do something that breaks all the rules? And it’s the title of my book, Do the Opposite. And go against all the grains of which you think is normal.
[00:35:21] So we spoke to every one of our clients said, look, we know you’re in this challenge. We know you’ve got to shut your checkbooks. We get all that. So we’re going to support you. We’re not going to ask you for any money. Um, but we need to show a lot of integrity. We need to be honest about our challenges. We need to speak every other day.
[00:35:38] You need to tell us what’s going on. The world will tell you what’s going on the world. We’ve got a supply chain that are also suffering. Um, and we want to adopt a philosophy that says we’re all going to hold our breath at the same time for the same amount of time, as long as we all trust each other.
[00:35:54] That’s the million dollar question. And to evidence that trust, what we’d like to do is you all owe us, you know, between 12, 14, 16 million quid each. How about you look at paying us 250 grand a month just so we can drip feed people, just show intent and to do what we can without putting you under immense pressure, uh, because we’re not going to put you under immense pressure.
[00:36:16] By taking that pressure away from them, they were happy to talk to us every day because it wasn’t a difficult conversation. Yeah. Whereas if they’re going to tell you they’re not going to pay you, it becomes a difficult conversation. And by that, we then spoke to every single supplier and at senior level.
[00:36:29] So he wasn’t sending people out to talk to them. We, the C suite were talking to the suppliers. So they got the integrity from us where we said, we’ll take calls from you 24 hours a day, seven days a week, right? If you’re fearful. Um, and. And we help them manage their own supply chain in a similar way. So we literally all held their breath together for so much time.
[00:36:49] And as a result of that, um, we got a huge amount of respect. So when the clients were suddenly in a position where they’d opened up after the first lockdown, um, they were sending us as much money as they could. Rather than it’s because we just create this deep meaningful relationship and that was essentially how we got through our supply chain trusted us implicitly because we always did what we said we always did what we said was going to do and we always communicated and the one lesson I learned in business from my previous life until now is the three most important words in business.
[00:37:22] What are they? Crossed. Good answer. Not right, but carry on. Hahahahaha.
[00:37:30] Adam Stott: Well go for it. Tell us.
[00:37:32] Jeff Dewing: So the first one is communicate. The second one is communicate. Yeah. Third one is communicate.
[00:37:40] Adam Stott: I’ll guess the third one. Hahahahaha. But that, super important, the communication, absolutely. And really, it’s an amazing, you know, an amazing story and then you bounce back, right?
[00:37:53] I’d love to hear a bit more about the book, actually, because people can read deeply about this, this story. Um, the book is doing the opposite. They can get that on Amazon, right? Yeah, they can, yeah. Bestseller. You said the response was, was huge on this, right?
[00:38:07] Jeff Dewing: Well, again, it knocked me for six. It wasn’t something I was planning.
[00:38:09] I did it because I was I was asked to do it as to create a legacy for the family and to share knowledge for those who are interested in that knowledge, but it isn’t a how to book. It isn’t a, um, uh, you know, here’s all the things you need to know book. It’s simply my story. You know, the things I got right, the things I got wrong, the things I learned.
[00:38:27] Um, but it’s, it’s, it’s a warts and all vulnerable, extremely vulnerable book. Um, and the bit that knocked me for six was one. It was tough to be that vulnerable, but I thought it’s not gonna be authentic unless I’m honest about it. Um, but the, the response I got from, from people that put reviews on and then contact me separately and God knows what.
[00:38:48] The amount of people that said, it’s almost like you’ve, you’ve played out my life. It was, it was so similar to other people’s lives to some greater or lesser extent. And, um, and that was the bit I found amazing. The amount of people that connected with and, um, and the bit I loved most about all of it was that the people that did sort of do the, the comments and reviews were.
[00:39:05] They simply said after I got through the first chapter, I just couldn’t put the book down. I had to carry on until I finished reading it. And that was a lovely thing to hear as well. So it, yeah, the book has been a big issue for, for me helping other people, because that’s what it’s about. We’re here to support and share knowledge and help, you know, help the world evolve.
[00:39:23] And, um, so yeah, I’m really, I’m really proud of it, but wasn’t expecting, wasn’t expecting the outcome we got.
[00:39:29] Adam Stott: Which is awesome. And you also so before we, you know, it’s been an amazing story. Amazing journeys. We’ve gone through everything. Um, and exactly what you’ve done in terms of bouncing back, managing that covid relationships.
[00:39:42] What’s the future of the business look like? You’ve got more cool things coming, right? I believe.
[00:39:47] Jeff Dewing: Well, yeah, you know, if you’re going to grow a business and solve problems, you’ve, you’ve got to keep innovating, right? You’ve got to keep looking forward and trying new things. And, um, one of the things we’ve learned is that even though we’ve done a great job at reversing or, or, or improving our industry in terms of approach, humility, culture, and so on and so on, um, We then moved into how do we do this fast?
[00:40:09] We’re not doing it fast enough. We’ve got to go faster. So we’ve just, we’ve moved into an environment, which we linked, we linked arms with Essex university and their tech team. We’ve designed a bit of technology and a bit of hardware that’s been named number one by Gartner as the most advanced IOT in the world.
[00:40:25] And, um, we’re just at the process now of, of commercial, not commercialized commercialized, but we’ve literally just launched that first client, which is the rank group, you know, Grosvenor casinos and stuff like that. Um, and this, this. But this sexy little box is the only box on the planet that is a full IOT can manage everything without a single sensor.
[00:40:45] It’s all just done from one point in your distribution board. It does things that no one else can do is painting to the whatever. So that’s now productizing our service, which therefore means we can scale immense pace. Um, as a result of that on what’s happening in the way in which is being received and the way in which is working and the endorsements we’re getting from some major clients.
[00:41:04] Um, We’re now predicting that the business will be valued because of its strength and its technology at circa 300 million within the next two years. So it’s all quite exciting stuff at the moment.
[00:41:15] Adam Stott: Yeah, sounds very, very exciting. It’s awesome. And look, I’ve loved hearing, you know, the story, the transparency is, is absolutely awesome.
[00:41:24] And I believe that, where can people get in touch with you, Jeff, if they wanted to kind of follow you? Do you have a particular social media channel that you use?
[00:41:31] Jeff Dewing: Um, so obviously LinkedIn as most people are these days. Um, I’ve got my own website, which is jeff ewing.co. Do uk. Um, on there, you, I you’ve, I’ve got me blogs that I do on there, and obviously you get sort of podcast.
[00:41:43] We’re just about to launch season four, the podcast. That’s cool. It’s up. Yeah, it’s, and again, it’s the same as, it’s the lead on from the book. It’s, you know, doing the opposite business disrupts, and I’ve had some great guests on this, Clive Woodward and Graham Gooch and, and various other people. So, um, but again, it’s about what, what is it?
[00:42:02] The bit I’m interested with leaders is more about what did you do that went completely against the grain that created success? What did you do? You know, it’s back to doing the opposite. Right? Give us examples of where you might have done the opposite. So they’re the sort of discussions we have on the podcast, or of course you can, you can look me up at the business, which is cloud fm group.dot com.
[00:42:19] Um, so yeah, they’re, they’re the sort of most appropriate channels I guess.
[00:42:23] Adam Stott: Brilliant. Well, look, thanks for coming on. I think the conversation has been amazing. I love the story. I love the transparency, the ups and downs, the battling on. Well done for, you know, so much success across your career. And I’ve really enjoyed the conversation.
[00:42:36] It’s been an absolute pleasure. And for those that are listening, You know, if you’ve enjoyed this episode, take a moment to share this with somebody that could get some value. Perhaps, you know, somebody in construction, in facilities management, in some other area, or just somebody that’s struggling. Maybe they’ve been through some ups and downs and they need some motivation, inspiration.
[00:42:55] Take a moment to share this podcast with them because it really could make a real difference in their life. Thank you again for being on Jeff. You’ve been absolutely amazing.
[00:43:03] Jeff Dewing: Really enjoyed the conversation. Thanks Adam. It’s been great to be here. Cheers, man.